EP. 12 / I would cry every night! When your career is hurting your marriage + how to grow your newsletter & sponsorships | Sonni Abatta & Lindsay Pinchuk
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What happens when you love your career but your relationship is suffering? And when you feel like you’re missing the important moments in your kids’ lives? TV anchor Sonni Abatta shares when she knew it was time to leave her high-profile anchor job that she ‘loved’, how her job was hurting her marriage, how she’s earning money now via different income streams like lifestyle blogging & podcasting and has great tips on how to figure out what you want to do next. Then Lindsay Pinchuk who grew the 7 figure business The Bump Club & Beyond (starting with just $500) has tips on how to build a community, grow your newsletter, get sponsors and brand partners.
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Takeaways from our guests:
TV anchor turned Podcast Host Sonni Abatta on how she knew it was time to leave the job she loved
“My relationship was not great. I didn't feel like I didn't know my husband anymore because I was gone from 2 pm to midnight. Our marriage was suffering.”
“I do believe women can do it all. But for me, I just couldn't do it all at once anymore. And I was trying for so long.”
Her different income streams
Sonni hosts a podcast called We Gotta Talk and has a lifestyle blog. She has partnerships on social media and on her blog and offers special discount codes. Sonni and I talk about the importance of focusing on search engine optimization! Remember that social media sneezes and we all catch a cold, so try to have channels with direct relationships to your audience and sponsors. Don’t solely rely on social media
Freelance hosting for events which is a great way she’s transferred her skills working for herself
Marketing Consultant, Founder of The Bump Club and Beyond, host of Dear FounderHer podcast Lindsay Pinchuk
How to Grow Your Community
Giveaways
Create a newsletter and make sure you’re delivering value in each email
Consider doing trades to get testimonials as you start out
How to Get Sponsors & Brand Partners
Highlight what the sponsor will get even if you don’t have a large social media following
Clarify who your audience is
Make clear how the brand partner or sponsor will be helped by this partnership
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EPISODE LINKS:
FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Kim Rittberg (00:01):
Former TV, anchor Sonni Abatta is here talking about her aha moment to leave a high profile job. She shares her personal story, her epiphany and advice she has for others.
Sonni Abatta (00:13):
My relationship was not great. I didn't feel like I didn't know my husband anymore. Cause I was gone from 2:00 PM to midnight. Like our marriage was suffering.
Kim Rittberg (00:22):
Plus Lindsay Pinchuk, founder of bump club and beyond, which was taking in seven figures in revenue is here with tips on building and monetizing a community, growing a newsletter and finding sponsors and brand partners.
Kim Rittberg (00:37):
Leave your lanyard and swipe card at the door. Welcome to mom's exit interview, a podcast for moms seeking fulfillment and contentment outside the traditional nine to five, whether you're considering taking the leap or you're already mid-air, this podcast is for you. You'll meet moms who are consultants, entrepreneurs stay at home moms with side hustles and part-time workers across various industries and levels. Plus every episode will have experts with tips so you can turn your inspiration into action. I'm Kim Rittberg. I was a Netflix executive and former head of video at us weekly and I'm a mom of two. I quit the corporate world and I've never looked back, but I'm still on this journey. So join me. We don't need a boss to give us permission or a promotion to leave the lives we want.
Kim Rittberg (01:31):
We have been loving your comments and feedback. Please keep in coming. I'll be reading them out on the show. So listen at the end. And if you have an awesome real mom moment, like an embarrassing or sweet parenting story or a recent win from your business, let us know and we'll put it in the show and don't forget to follow the show and leave a review and a five star reading. It helps grow the show and please share it with a friend today. We're talking to Sonni Abatta The host of we got talk podcast. In addition to hosting her podcast, she's also a freelance in person host as well. Sonni was a TV news, anchor and reporter for 15 years. She's a mom of three based in Orlando. She shares her story of knowing when it was ready to leave her high profile job as an anchor, how her job was hurting her marriage and she shares how she's earning money now through a few different revenue streams and offers great insights on how to sit in the quiet moments and find what you really want. We focus on moms shifting away from the nine to five. So talk to me about your own shift. Where were you and what was your aha moment to leave?
Sonni Abatta (02:33):
But I spent 15 years working in television news, which was, I, I really feel fortunate to be able to say that I feel like I landed in my true calling in a job, like pretty early on. So they were 15 really great years. I started working at 19 as a sideline reporter for the Fox sports network in Pittsburgh for like a, my league baseball team. Like I fell into it early and thought, oh gosh, this is actually perfect for me. I'm kind of a, I'm like an info nerd. I like to know things. I'm, I'm curious. And I love people. So I got, got a really great opportunity to start early and having spent 15 really good years doing what you love felt great. Um, but I like many women got married and had kids and really quickly realized that the schedule was making it really hard for me to like be a happy person, not a worker.
Sonni Abatta (03:24):
I would get into those four walls at work and I loved it. I feel even horrible saying this. I didn't even have mom guilt leaving them. I was like, I love my job. They're in great hands with a good nanny. I'm a big believer in good help. And we found good help early. But what really started to wear on me was just the inability to be there in moments when I wanted to be there, my relationship was not great. I didn't feel like I didn't know my husband anymore. Cause I was gone from 2:00 PM to midnight. Um, and I don't ever wanna like lie. Like I guess I could be vague and be like, yeah, you know, it was really hard. No, it sucked. It actually like our marriage was suffering because I was gone so long, but you can only do so much away from your family and your partner and feel connected.
Sonni Abatta (04:08):
So that was the first thing I started to notice. Gosh, like you feel like we're fighting more and I'm not as present as I wanna be. Um, that was one thing I started to realize, God, I have no friends outside of work and adding the third factor in after having kids, I was a nursing mom. And so I was pumping all the time and all the complications of doing that while working that I just started to really get worn down. So I would go home 6 45, do the dinner, do the, putting the kids down, wipe the face off, wipe the whole face of makeup off, put them so I could lay down and not like leave cake makeup on their bed. <laugh> um, put the makeup back on, would get in the car and call my mom at eight 30 or nine o'clock every night on my way back for the 10 o'clock show.
Sonni Abatta (04:54):
And I'd say I I'm so sad. I would cry, cry to her like a 30 something year old woman. And I was in tears and I said, something just doesn't feel rights, mom. I don't understand like, what do I feel like this? I hate this, but I love it. I love my job, but I hate this because we were raised and rightfully so to believe that we could do it all. I do believe women can do it all. But for me, I just couldn't do it all at once anymore. And I was trying for so long.
Kim Rittberg (05:19):
I love how honest you are about the partner aspect of it. Cuz so many of us focus on being a good parent and try really hard. And my husband is very proactive about saying like, let's go to dinner. You and me I'm like, oh right. I give you my times my children, right? You, I chose to marry you way before those kids came. We like each other. So I, I just love your honesty about the fact that you know, we're moms, but we're also, if, if you are we're moms, we're spouses and you made a commitment to be a partner in that relationship. And when you're giving it all to everyone else, you forget that there's someone sharing your room. That you've pretty much ignored all day or all week and you haven't really checked in and you haven't made them laugh and they haven't made you laugh. And it's yeah, I had, I think I really, you know, I sort of have forgotten about that aspect of it. The decision to step back. What was the hardest part of that decision? Cause I imagine leaving a job is very hard to get kind of high profile and people know you and they know your name.
Sonni Abatta (06:17):
I really credit my ability to identify myself outside of my job, with how I was raised. My parents were always like you're, you're not your job. You're more than that. You're no one can take that experience away from me and I need to, I need to move on to something else, but I will still be the same person.
Kim Rittberg (06:36):
And what did your parents do? Were, was did your mom work cuz you had mentioned that your parents sort of raised you to say you're not what your job is. I have found that through the show, a lot of what we are have ingrained is what we saw growing up. And, and that's a model, both for relationships, but also for how we show up in the work world.
Sonni Abatta (06:51):
Right? So my mom was a full-time working mom. So her, her dad came over from Italy when he was very young. All of either my grandparents or my great grandparents are all immigrants. So had a very immigrant mentality growing up. I was only in my direct line of people, only the second person to graduate college. My grandfather only went to school until sixth grade. He became a master plumber though, who could like map out a room with an intelligent man. But there's something different about when you come from a family that understands that you need to work to get good things you need to try and you need to, it was this, you just keep going forward. I didn't, my mom did not go to college. My dad did go to college. He was a school teacher and a high school football coach and track coach for like 30 years who is had amazing impact on all of his students.
Sonni Abatta (07:37):
So I loved seeing that. And my mom was like an executive assistant for like an international company, but she worked my whole life. So I thought, gosh, of course I'm gonna do that. Um, I was raised by two really efficient people. Like there was not a thing out of place in my house growing up, she was like cleaning. And then when she wasn't cleaning, she was working and it still, it worked. But I have to remind myself that that was a different era and that was a different job. And it certainly was a different shift too. You know, 2:00 PM to midnight will wear you out physically in addition to mentally. So, um, but yeah, those were the things that I was raised with. It just helped me realize, okay, you know, you, you can do it all. But what I had to learn individually was how to do that the right way. If that makes sense.
Kim Rittberg (08:23):
That makes a lot of sense. I also, my dad was an immigrant. My dad came here after college, actually for his master's and he ran his own business and he was such a workhorse. And my mom, she was a lawyer. She worked for herself. Um, and my grandparents on the other side, one was an immigrant. It's always been that sort of work, work, work mentality. And everyone in my family, like it was never taken for granted. Like you work, you work hard, whatever you're doing, even if you don't like it, right. You try to do the best you can. Mm-hmm <affirmative> um, you know, it doesn't matter if you're a cater waiter or an anchor or, or a coach like you do the best and you take pride in it. Yes. And I think that I really love your point though, that it's not, it's learning those lessons and applying them in a different way though, because you can still work hard and you can still invest your effort and time and ambition, but it can look different.
Kim Rittberg (09:18):
It doesn't have to be in the same jobs because the working world is changing. All the jobs are different. And so the digital revolution is here. And so how do I still take those things that make me, me and my ambition and your drives? And you're like, you're saying, no one will outwork you. So how do you apply that in a different way? And I'm sure that our I'm sure that our parents and grandparents are or would be very proud of us and the lives we're building, you know? Cause I think that's it. It's true. We're still working just as hard mm-hmm <affirmative> so everybody loves you, everyone knows your name and then you decide you're gonna leave. What's that process look like? How long does it take you to crystallize what you're gonna do? A lot of people say, Hmm, I'm a teacher, I'm a therapist now, how do I make money outside of this office?
Sonni Abatta (09:58):
I always had a relatively active social media presence. I'm a share by nature. I'm a, I was a writing major too. So I like to write, so I immediately went into blogging or maybe just like, um, sort of micro blogging, like on Facebook, um, just because I liked sharing. And it was a really unique time in my life having two young children and one on the way where I was craving connection. I'm sure you can relate to this too. And social media made it really easy for me to share my struggles as a mom and hear from other people. So I did a podcast eventually launched that. I think that was, that was in late 2017. I started recording. So it's been a few years of that. We got a talk came around about a year ago, a year and a half ago, I guess when I realized that the content was shifting that I of course loved talking about mothering and like raising young kids, but that I, my itch for news and current events and like conversations about other topics started to creep in.
Sonni Abatta (10:57):
So I really thought long and hard about like what it could be called. And I found myself saying this phrase all the time to like people important to me, it's like, we gotta talk about this. We gotta talk that I was like, that should be the name. So we rebranded. And um, it's like a motto I live by and that's why the show is so fun for me to do because we have on people who, who have important stories to tell, it's not just, um, it's not just news. Although we have certainly covered Ukraine and Russia or other topics of, of sort of current interest. But we also go into the lifestyle side of things and some of my most popular episodes are about hormones and like how though, how they control everything in your brain as a woman and you know, so it could be lifestyle. It could be news, but it, the, the unifying theme is like a real deep dive and a space for nuanced conversation. How
Kim Rittberg (11:53):
Do you monetize what you're doing? How's that
Sonni Abatta (11:54):
Going? There's many ways. So there are social partnerships. So I can work with, um, us company. I usually work with smaller companies kind of in the health or beauty space. Um, and you can charge, I don't know, a couple hundred bucks say for a static Instagram post all the way up to a couple thousand dollars for, um, you know, a package that might include a social activation, whether that's grid and stories. Um, in addition to an out on the podcast, my blog unexpectedly has been doing really well lately. We're really working on optimizing a lot of the content. So I take the interviews that I do with a show and I write, I boil 'em down into articles. So another option that you can monetize if someone were in this space is through the blog. Um, it a well optimized post can bring, I have found more money and value to any package I'm offering to a possible advertiser than social can because number one, it lives longer.
Sonni Abatta (12:49):
Um, number two, it's much more thorough in detail to number three, it's on a platform that I will forever own. So I can go back in and very easily make changes and, you know, update it with the new coupon code. And I can say to the advertiser or the per the company, um, you know, let me know if you guys have any big sales coming up or anything, I can personalize, whatever it is so that that post will always have current information. So those are the main ways. And then I, I also still do a lot of freelance hosting. So like Orlando is huge in the conference base and I've worked with companies on Britain, doing something with like, you know, a travel group next month where, um, helping to host their, their big show for a few days. And I've worked with individual companies who are trying to tell their stories. A lot of them during COVID on video, who had no experience, um, boiling down their brand story or presenting something in a cohesive quick manner. So I work with my producer, who you also met when we, when we interviewed you a couple of, um, a little while ago who helps me do we write a script? We write a rundown, we, you know, walk through and help them block it. We're just like a one man host production writing team two, man <laugh>. And so I do, I make money
Kim Rittberg (14:01):
To two old man, two, two woman <laugh> yeah, that's
Sonni Abatta (14:04):
Right. So there's so
Kim Rittberg (14:05):
Sickness it like in TV, when a person shoots, edits and reports, it's like a one man band. I'm like, it's a one person band cuz we're all women. Okay. What tips if someone sees your story and they want to take away, what can I do that they're learning from your stories? What tips would you give someone with your sort of similar background or just even relative relevant, um, experience? What tips would you give them on how to shift out and how to find clients and the mix of work you're doing?
Sonni Abatta (14:32):
I would say the first thing is to get clear on your offer and who you are. So I'm not saying I've done this well, but I'm starting to finally crystallize who I am as a brand and as a company, a one woman company. Um, so that I can in turn, tell people when they ask I'm your, I'm your one woman band for hosting? You know, you need someone to come in and tell your company's story, hire me. So I would say work on your hook, work on your, who you are and what you offer. That's number one. And that's not gonna come easily usually. So don't beat yourself up. If it takes a while. I would say number two is, remember what I said before, which is you carry your skill set with you. So let go. Any, um, shame or doubts you have about having to retell the story of leaving your job.
Sonni Abatta (15:19):
Cause there's gonna be a lot of people that ask you, well, why did you leave? And are you happy? And do you ever miss it and answer it and then move on? You know, like don't, it's okay to move beyond what you did. So just remember that because if you, if you're always the type of person who is looking back on what you did, people aren't gonna hire you to do what you do now, right? And don't be afraid to associate your face with your brand. You may not be comfortable in the beginning. And I've talked to so many people who are not, I understand it. So many of us put up barriers between what we do and who we are at work versus who we are personally, but you're so much more likely to attract a customer if you show up as you everywhere. So I would say that too, really lean into the value of your own personality and brand.
Kim Rittberg (16:01):
I love those tips. And, and also, you know what I like about what you're saying about how you're creating revenue on your own is that you do what similar to what I do is a mix of things. Mm-hmm <affirmative> so some people are hiring you for what they know you do. Mm-hmm <affirmative> so maybe you're a host or a spokesperson, which is not the same, but similar to an anchor, you present as the face of their business or their message mm-hmm <affirmative>. But then the other things are preparing their messaging and the blogging, like that's new, it's correlated to what you did before, but it's a slightly different shift. So I think I like how you were thinking about it. It's all, it all has a unique differentiator of what you bring to the table. Mm-hmm <affirmative> but it's thinking about it as value to other people.
Kim Rittberg (16:39):
I love to also the tip about not the tip, but when you were saying that you write blog posts, I always advise clients who have enough time or resources to convert social, to blog posts, because in your sleep you are getting back links. Yes. So your blog posts are getting back links and I really think you're super sharp about social media owns your content. You'll notice some, some days, some days my Facebook posts get like no views, right? Or some days my Instagram reels get thousands. And you just can't predict that. But if it lives on your page, no one can take it down. Right. Except while Squarespace, but <laugh>, you know, it's yours. So, um, are you happy?
Sonni Abatta (17:17):
I'm happy. Yeah. I'm happy. I've gotten asked so many times. Um, I mean I'm not happy all the time, you know what I mean? But overall, yeah, I'm pretty, I'm pretty darn unhappy. In fact, I was talking to someone else who still in TV the other day and they were like, you know, would you ever consider coming back? Like, what if I talk to someone for you and I, my body went like this, like clenched up. I was like, no, you get away from me. I mean, not because again, not because I look down on that job or think, I don't think I'm better. It's just that it was so my so new and my body knew for so long that it was just incompatible with how I needed to live my life.
Kim Rittberg (17:52):
Wow. I just so admire your clarity. I think it's, it's hard to get that clear, but I love, I love your confidence in the clarity. Cause I think it helps other people and you know, it's it, it having, having certainty about what you want is awesome. I had a really great media client in my first, like two and a half years of working an amazing media client. We had a great working relationship. I really liked them and I was working part-time for them. And they asked me, you know, would you be interested in working full-time my body was like, and they were like, you can say no. And I was like, no, I love you guys, but I'm really not interested in doing full time anywhere. Mm-hmm <affirmative> if it were anywhere, it would be you guys. I am not looking for that at all. But I had the same thing as you. I was like, I was like on a walk I'm like, thank you so much for the offer, but I have to decline making this big career transition along with becoming a mom. And then up till now, now you're building your own business and you have your own podcast. What's been the hardest part of
Sonni Abatta (18:56):
It. The lack of a blueprint. It was it's the biggest challenge. And it's also offers me the most freedom. Um, you know, when you're used to being in a structure where you're working toward the next reward or the next great position and, and that system is taken away, there's no longer a way for me to objectively measure. I mean, there is certain ways, but you know, in, in mostly there's no way for me to objectively understand that I'm advancing, right? Like only I know what I'm doing. I can look at it. Sure. In terms of finances, how much did I bring in this year versus last year? Or I can look at it in terms of, you know, the number of cool guests I booked, but I think that's been difficult because as a person who's really who really loves working and understanding, okay, what do I need to do next to make the most impact or that that can be, it can be a little tricky.
Sonni Abatta (19:49):
So what I, what I try to do, and then you can start to doubt yourself, right? Like, well, why did I do this? God, I was in a great job that I, you know, had everything laid out for me. And now here I am at, you know, three o'clock in the morning wondering, oh, what do I do with this rebrand? You know? So I just try to find ways to like reward or congratulate myself on little milestones that I hit, because it can be really unmooring to not have that structure around me. That's been a challenge for sure. And therefore, I thank God. I'm always failing. But then when I look at it and I step back and I'm like, oh my gosh, look at all the cool things I've done. Since I started working for myself, then it becomes more real and easier for me to keep going.
Kim Rittberg (20:33):
I am the exact same way, I think when we're used to goals. And when the goals aren't clear, mm-hmm <affirmative> what does, how do you measure success? You have to create your own yard stick. Well, I don't know. Should this yard stick be 10 inches, 40 inches? One inch should be blue or red or rainbow colored. It's right. It's hard. Cuz when you're, when you're measuring it for yourself and I guess I try to like set intentional measurements. I'm like, okay, X project is successful if I'm proud of it. Yes. This client project is successful. If I think it's good and all of the other stuff accolades or social media, this and that engagement, what it's actually like, we have those things in ourselves, but, but it's hard to stay that way. It's hard to stay checked in.
Sonni Abatta (21:15):
Yeah. I love that. Someone told me once too, I was at this conference and they were talking about making like a brag book for yourself. Like have a little notes app in there and like things that I did this, or even like sometimes I'll keep track of like even cool partnerships, like, oh I did I hosted this really cool thing. And I, or I, you know, had this partnership that brought me this X amount of money or, you know, it's just like, and if I write it down and look at it and I'm like, you're a badass, you got this <laugh>, you know,
Kim Rittberg (21:41):
A hundred percent. I have a, a file in my Gmail that says positive feedback file. And I just open it when I wanna feel good about myself. And I'm actually thinking about, I'm probably gonna make myself a little photo album that nobody else will ever look at. But me of just career things, I've done like photos of me on big assignments, like, you know, covering inaugurations and meeting interesting celebrities when I worked in TV and trying to hold on to that amazing. The amazing things I did cuz no one takes that from you, but it's it, you know, it kind of fades into your memory. But having that, I, you know, I like that. It's a brag book making my own brag book opposite of a burn book from mean girls.
Sonni Abatta (22:17):
Yeah, that's right. We don't.
Kim Rittberg (22:20):
What advice do you wish you had known earlier in this stage of your career and life and personal life
Sonni Abatta (22:25):
That it will all work out if I just lean into my instincts and intuition and I wish I would've known that sitting still and being quiet is the key to understanding 95% of what is cluttering your brain.
Kim Rittberg (22:49):
I love that I find
Kim Rittberg (22:51):
Stillness. I find it's much easier to keep driving that car at 80 miles per hour than to slow down. You can listen to, we gotta talk with Sonni. We'll have her podcast linked out in the show notes, along with her social handles as well. Lindsay Pinchuk founded the bump club and beyond with just $500 and grew it to seven figures in revenue. It was acquired in 2019. Pretty cool. Right now, Lindsay is the host of the podcast, dear founder, which I was a guest on. And Lindsay has amazing tips on growing a newsletter, building your audience and getting sponsors. I know that you are such an expert in building and monetizing a community. What are your top tips to building and monetizing a community?
Lindsay Pinchuk (23:38):
So the first thing is you wanna lay out in your head or on paper, how it is you're going to monetize it. It, because there are so many ways that you can monetize your community and you cannot be everything to all people. So, you know, are you gonna have a class? Are you going to use affiliates? Are you going to host events that are paid? There are all these different ways that you can monetize them, um, monetize your community. So you wanna really hone in on what it is that you're going to do. So that is the first thing. The second thing is, and I think this is the most important. You need to know that it's not gonna happen overnight. Um, you know, you need to really set the realistic expectation for yourself that you're not gonna show up on social media. And then all of a sudden be generating revenue tomorrow from this, it is a slow build.
Lindsay Pinchuk (24:22):
Really is it is, it is a slow built. And you know, from that, it is also very important to tell you and to tell your listeners, you have to show up as yourself. Like I built this community legitimately by showing up as an expectant mom and being like my stomach itches does yours and relating to the community and sharing my stories as a pregnant mom. And in doing that, people felt really connected to me. I mean, I, I still get emails from people like, oh, I went to bump club and this and that and you know, DMS, it's so good to see you here and find you again. They know my story. They know I had gestational diabetes. I mean, I would be walking down the street in Chicago and people would be like, oh my God, your birth story. You know, and people would know because I put myself out there and I put myself out there authentically.
Lindsay Pinchuk (25:14):
I wasn't always selling something. I was just me and really, and truly that is how I started bump club. I showed up as myself. So show up as yourself, do not compromise your values for a paycheck. Don't, don't SP take sponsored products from products that you don't believe in because that is bad, bad, bad. You can never earn back the trust that, you know, once you, once you lose the trust of your community, you cannot earn it back. And we, you know, we never took products from brands that we didn't believe in at bump clubs. So, you know, all of these things together are really what you have to keep in mind when you're starting your community. That's kind of like the start. And then, you know, of course there's like next steps that we would go. I mean, I can have a, we could do a whole podcast on this.
Kim Rittberg (25:58):
We'll do a whole podcast, webinar, Instagram, live webinar, everything. <laugh> I love it.
Lindsay Pinchuk (26:02):
Great. I'm down.
Kim Rittberg (26:04):
I have heard you tout the importance of newsletter and I am a big believer in it. What are your tips on growing a newsletter? You know, people are so heavy on social, but the truth is social sneezes and you catch a cold, you could lose all your followers. You're not showing up. You're only showing up to 10% of them at any one. Given time a newsletter is so important. So talk to me about what are your tips for growing a newsletter?
Lindsay Pinchuk (26:24):
So in terms of growing a newsletter, so with bump club and beyond, it was really seamless for me, right? Like we had events. So all of those emails were going into our database. We would do giveaways. All of those emails were going into our database. You know, it's funny because now people talk about like lead magnets all the time. Like we didn't really have lead magnets at bump club. It was really, you know, through our events, through our, our webinars, um, our free webinars through giveaways, giveaways were a huge way that we captured email addresses because every mom wanted to win a stroller. Every mom wanted to win $200 to Starbucks, you know? So that was a really great way that we were able to capture, but it's not just capturing, it's capturing and keeping them there. So you have to make sure that when people come into your newsletter, you are giving them something back and a reason to stay. So make sure that you have a really good nurture campaign to follow up with why are they here? What do they wanna do? What, like, here's how I can help you and keep in mind that it's not about you. It's about them. So like, you need to like anything that you think you wanna do, you need to make sure that your community is really wanting it from you and that, that you will give it to them and they will stick around because of that. Now Lindsay Pinchuk 2.0, it's a little bit different because
Kim Rittberg (27:34):
That's what I was gonna ask. Right? Because a product that you can give, do a giveaway versus a person who's a service provider like you, how is that different to build your newsletter?
Lindsay Pinchuk (27:42):
So now, so it's funny that you say like that the internet, um, sneezes and you catch a cold. So my Instagram was actually hacked in January and I, I was, I literally was throwing up because I was like, I'm not gonna get this back. I was like curled up in a ball in bed. I was like, this is my whole business. And it was really in that moment that I realized that it, my email list is just as important for this as it was for bump club. So I did create some lead magnets. I'm starting to put them out there. I talk about it on the podcast as well, like sign up for my newsletter and I have to be better at it. But you know, those are kind of the, the ways that I am getting people into the, into the email newsletter, the biggest tip that I would say is, do not be afraid to give away your content.
Lindsay Pinchuk (28:25):
Like it, it like so many people are like, oh, but that's what people pay me for. And blah, blah, blah, no people pay you for you. Like if people are paying you, it's, they're paying for your connection for you as a person to show up and help them, the content they can get online, you know? I mean, it's it that's so you need to make sure that you are servicing your community, giving them information, giving them a reason to get on that newsletter and to get on that newsletter because you're gonna give them something special in their inbox once a week. And that is something that I'm still trying to develop and figure out with Lindsay Pinchuk 2.0.
Kim Rittberg (29:00):
And so if, if a person like a service professional or an influencer wants to start approaching sponsors, but they're not a huge, huge following, but they do wanna start approaching sponsors. How do they do that? And what do you recommend they say in their note?
Lindsay Pinchuk (29:15):
So the very first thing that I would do is look through your contacts to see if you know, someone that can make an introduction. Because if you have someone that is even like a Luke warm contact, that's gonna go much further than you reaching out on your own. And you know, maybe start there because the game is you wanna get sponsors so that you can use those sponsors to build new sponsors. So, you know, it kind of doesn't matter who's first, right? So if you have a lukewarm content or someone that's low hanging fruit, that is probably where I would start. But actually before that, what I did with bump club and even somewhat, what I've done now is I did trades or I did free things because you wanna build your testimonials. You wanna build your reputation, you wanna build your portfolio of the people that you're working with so that you can leverage that to have someone actually pay you. And I did that both with bump club and with Lindsay Pinchuk, 2.0,
Kim Rittberg (30:14):
Lindsay says, as a service provider or consultant, you could consider doing a trade as you start out,
Lindsay Pinchuk (30:21):
I have done trades. So I would say to like, someone like yourself, like, Hey Kim, I see you do video. I do more community building. Do you wanna do a little bit of a trade? And then I would ask you for a testimonial. So that is something I did do a trade in the beginning with someone. And it was great feedback. I also taught a free class in the beginning and that free class gave me testimonials that I still use. I received probably 25 testimonials as to how my class helped these low, these small female founders to grow their social media. It was a very targeted social media class. So that is not a bad idea when you're first starting out as a service provider, because if you get a testimonial and then you can use it through your marketing materials, that's amazing. Right? So like that's an amazing way to, to get a sponsor as well, or a partner as well.
Lindsay Pinchuk (31:11):
So I would start with the Luke Warren, maybe do a free class to get a testimonial. And then in terms of reaching out, don't make it too long because no one has all day to read, right? You do not wanna send people a form email, like don't do that. Like it's, it's so obvious when people are like copying and pasting, copying and pasting. You also wanna make sure that you are telling them what they will get. Like it is not about you. It is about, you want to go into a partnership with them in mind, like you will benefit from this because I can offer this. That is how you wanna lead with it. And you want them to know that, you know, their business, it is so important that they know that you know, what their business is and what their objectives are before you even have that conversation.
Lindsay Pinchuk (31:57):
You also need to know you're gonna get a lot of nos and that's okay. But keep trying, keep finding reasons to reach out that's part of sales. You know, someone might say no, but then a couple weeks later you might have an episode of a podcast or a client testimonial reach back out and say, Hey, just wanted you to wanted to share this with you. You really have to nurture these relationships. They don't happen overnight. I was just interviewing someone for my podcast that she's, she got this huge sponsorship. And she said, it took two years, you know? And it, it, it happens, but you have to be willing to really pound the pavement and put in the time to nurture the relationship.
Kim Rittberg (32:32):
And no matter the size of your audience, you just have to show the brand your value. Whether you have a thousand, 10,000, a hundred thousand followers, you say, correct. My audience is made of moms from this area or corporate of this area or lawyers or whatever. So cuz they might be wor they might find the value. They might find the value in identifying that demographic. Instead of when you're talking about traditional advertising, they're trying to reach millions of people on this big marketplace, but you're giving engaged, targeted users.
Lindsay Pinchuk (32:58):
So, and I, I, what I can say about that is bump club. Wasn't like a behemoth, you know, I mean, we were doing RFPs at the end for really big brands like through agencies. And we were up against scary mommy. We were up against motherly and I had to teach by sales people. Exactly what you just said. This isn't like a CPM buy with bump club. Like when this is a targeted, engaged audience, they are so invested in us. And that is what my sales people had to sell because we, we didn't have millions and millions and millions of people or followers. And, but we had a lot of engagement
Kim Rittberg (33:37):
And for listeners, CPM is cost per mill. So when, uh, people are buying brand new content, they're thinking of the cost per thousands of users. And when you're really a custom product or an influencer or an individual, you have to offer something besides, oh, it's X dollars per thousands of users. Cuz if you only have 5,000 followers or 1000 or 20,000, you're not gonna get so much money, but to really highlight the niche and your tar and your really targeted and focused users is really valuable. And I actually, I did a lot of branded content at pop, pop sugar and us weekly for mom brands and women, female brands. So I know exactly what you're talking about. So just to review, Lindsay had some great tips and here are some ways to grow. Community is through giveaways, make sure in a newsletter, as you grow your newsletter, give something back to your readers, to keep nurturing them, give them a reason to keep reading and coming back. And as you start out consider doing trades. So you can build up your testimonials and to get sponsors and brand partners highlight what they will get and clarify who your audience is and how that audience can help them. Even if you're following is not huge. Thanks again to Lindsay for joining us. You can listen to the dear founder podcast. It'll be linked out in the show notes.
Kim Rittberg (34:50):
I'm sharing out this great note from listen Armika she said your podcast has been a godsend. Thank you for being so candid in these conversations and launching such an inspiring podcast. I'm taking many notes for where the future is taking me as a new career mom. Well, I feel the exact same way. <laugh> I learn on every episode, every interview I feel inspired and I take notes. And so that is what I want. I want the community learn and grow and feel inspired to live more intentionally. And um, don't forget, drop your own comments please, or your awesome real mom moments. Like a great moment you had as a parent or a funny embarrassing moment or a great professional win. So you drop that either in the podcast review section or on the contact form in moms, exit interview.com. We'll be reading them out.
Kim Rittberg (35:48):
Thank you so much for listening. We wanna hear from you tell us what topics you want us to cover and what questions you have for upcoming shows and experts. We will read everyone and we will use them. You can find us everywhere, go to mom's exit interview.com, scroll down to find the contact button, or you can DM me on Instagram at Kim Rittberg, or you can leave your feedback right inside your review in the podcast app. Please follow the show in apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen and leave review in a five star rating. And don't forget to share it with people who will find it valuable. It's truly meant to be a resource. And this is mom's exit interview. I'm your host and executive producer, Kim Berg. The show is produced by Henry street media. John Hallit is our editor and Aliza. Friedlander is our producer and publicist.