Ep.95/ How to Get Your Freelance Writing Published: Estelle Erasmus
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Estelle Erasmus, author of Writing That Gets Noticed: Find Your Voice, Become a Better Storyteller, Get Published is an award-winning journalist, a professor of writing at New York University, a magazine editor, an in-demand public speaker, and the host of the Freelance Writing Direct podcast. Estelle discusses the crucial elements of pitching to editors, crafting compelling articles, and establishing yourself as a thought leader in the writing industry. She also emphasizes the importance of grabbing an editor's attention with a catchy subject line and showcasing your unique voice and perspective in your pitch.
If you are an aspiring writer, you will benefit from Estelle’s expertise navigating the competitive publishing world and achieving success as an author.
In this episode you will learn:
The importance of attention-grabbing subject lines in pitches (3:04)
Should you always get paid for your writing and when is it okay to do an unpaid article (8:59)
Finding credible sources for your writing pieces (17:49)
Infusing personal narrative into writing to create more of a connection (20:42)
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Ever wonder how to get your pitches to stand out?
Estelle Erasmus, author of Writing That Gets Noticed: Find Your Voice, Become a Better Storyteller, Get Published is an award-winning journalist, a professor of writing at New York University, a magazine editor, an in-demand public speaker, and the host of the Freelance Writing Direct podcast She shares valuable insights into the world of freelance writing. Estelle discusses the crucial elements of pitching to editors, crafting compelling articles, and establishing yourself as a thought leader in the writing industry. She also emphasizes the importance of grabbing an editor's attention with a catchy subject line and showcasing your unique voice and perspective in your pitch.
If you are an aspiring writer, you will benefit from Estelle’s expertise navigating the competitive publishing world and achieving success as an author.
In this episode you will learn:
The importance of attention-grabbing subject lines in pitches (3:04)
Should you always get paid for your writing and when is it okay to do an unpaid article (8:59)
Finding credible sources for your writing pieces (17:49)
Infusing personal narrative into writing to create more of a connection (20:42)
Quotes from our guest:
“An editor is looking for content, they're looking for stories. So your first piece of what I call valuable word real estate is in the subject line of the email that you're going to send to the editor. It needs to be a title that is compelling, that evokes emotion.”
“I know there are places that don't pay and I don't advocate that my students go there. I do think there are enough paying places at the moment where they can go.”
“AI can really support a writer. It can help you think of ideas. It can help you organize your work. It can help you take video clips and break them down into short segments. And so there are so many ways to use AI but not for writing though. Not for writing.”
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Kim (00:02):
If you're interested in freelance writing, you have to listen to Estelle Erasmus. She's a professor at NYU, a former magazine editor in chief and she teaches you everything, how to pitch an editor, how to write that article, why you need to insert yourself into your essay, and who to pitch to.
Kim (00:19):
Welcome to the exit interview with Kim Rittberg. Do you work for yourself and want to supercharge your business while still having fun? Well, this is your go-to podcast part MBA Part Cheer Squad. Every week I'll be joined by top business owners who share the secrets to their success. After I found myself working during childbirth true story, I quit my executive media job to bet on myself fighting the fear and imposter syndrome to eventually earn six awards, an in-demand speaking career and features in Fast Company and Business Insider. Now I'm here to celebrate all you rock stars betting on yourself, and I want to help you win Tune in every Wednesday to hear from remarkable founders and don't miss our Solo Friday episodes, a treasure trove of video and podcasting mini masterclasses with me. Exit the Grind, enter success on your own terms. Don't forget to subscribe today and grab my free video tips at my website, kimrittberg.com.
Kim (01:21):
I am really excited to bring in Estelle Erasmus. As you know, I help professionals become thought leaders through video and podcasts, which that really means is getting your voice out there and writing articles and getting more people to hear you, to see you, to understand your point of view is super important. As a part of my business, I've begun contributing to Fast Company Magazine. I've published an op-Ed. I've been featured in different articles, so I've been a part of that publishing process on the business owner end. And before that, as the head of video at US Weekly, I worked sign a magazine and before that I was a TV writer and producer. So to me it's really fun to get to bring in Estelle Erasmus and she has so much knowledge and advice about freelance writing, so I'm going to get right into it. Alright, we have today Estelle Erasmus.
(02:05):
She is the author of Writing that Gets Noticed, Find Your Voice, Become a Better Storyteller, Get Published, and she's an award-winning journalist, a professor of writing at New York University, a magazine editor, an in-demand public speaker, and the host of Freelance Writing Direct podcast. Her articles for the New York Times and the Washington Post have gone global virally. She has appeared on GMA Good Morning America and has had her articles discussed on the View. She's also taught coach and mentored many writers who've gone on to be widely published. She received a 2023 NYU School of Professional Studies Teaching Excellence Award, a 2023 Zibi Award naming writing that gets noticed. The best book for the writer. She's an American Society of Journalists and authors award winner and was a cast member in the inaugural New York City production of Listened to your Mother's Storytelling Show. You can find her at Estelleerasmus.com.
(02:51):
You could sign up for her newsletter and get a free pitching guide. And on social media, she's at Estelle Erasmus on TikTok, Instagram, X and Threads and her substack Craft advice, pitching opportunities and bonus clips is estelleserasmus.substack.com. And Estelle, I want to jump right in because I love this topic. I work with a lot of people, my clients, my students, they want to get their name out there. Of course, freelance writing is a great way. Talk to me about what is the first thing people should think about if they're interested in freelance writing?
Estelle (03:21):
Well, the first thing they should think about is really how to get the attention of an assigning editor. And these days it's even harder than ever before because so many publications have closed the print publications. Many of them have closed unless they're niche publications. But an editor is looking for content, they're looking for stories. So your first piece of what I call valuable word real estate is in the subject line of the email that you're going to send to the editor. It needs to be a title that is compelling, that evokes emotion. When I was pitching the editor at the New York Times, well for the first piece that went viral for me at the New York Times, I wrote pitch from journalist How to Bully Proof Your Child. So the editor got like 300 emails a day, but that title got her attention and she got back to me later that day, said, yes, can you share a little bit more information? And I had given her a fully fleshed out pitch, and so I knew that there was interest and by the end of the day she had assigned me that story which went globally viral.
Kim (04:43):
And one question I have in there and then I have so many questions for you. I love this topic, should you include the word pitch in a pitch,
Estelle (04:50):
But you should say pitch from journalist or pitch from essayist because otherwise the editor can think it's a pitch from a PR person, which they're getting as well.
Kim (05:02):
Oh, I love that. I've actually never heard that advice before and I do a lot of panels with PR people and content people, so I love that tip. I've actually written one thing that I've done to get on podcasts and I don't know, I haven't pitched too much honestly about writing. I contribute to fast company monthly, but that happens sort of through networking and organic work. But in my podcast pitch, I always write like guest colon, former Netflix exec, so they know a, I am a person who's done interesting things, but also a, I hadn't really thought about that. It's not from a publicist, but I actually more thought it makes me stand out. It just helps somebody think, oh, Netflix, that's just interesting. But I like your flagging of let them know that it's from you and who you are. What about if they're not a journalist? So talk to me about freelance writing. Break it down to me of who are the people who are pursuing freelance writing that you work with? What are the different buckets?
Estelle (05:55):
So there are different areas of freelance writing. There's different niches, right? Somebody could be focused on health. I got my start, I was a magazine editor, but when I was writing, I was writing primarily about health and beauty. And so that is a big area and it's changed over the years. It's much more, it used to be like 10 ways to lose 10 pounds, and that is verone these days. It's very much all sorts of body images are appropriate to write about and you're not going to do anything that's disparaging. There is finance writers, so they're writing and like our friend Bobby Rebel, she writes that way. And then there are people who write about psychology and I write about psychology and publishing and I always would say I write about the three Ps, parenting, psychology and publishing. That would be in my pitches to the editors to identify.
(06:56):
And I would include three clips. And so there's people who write about science, there's people who do content writing now, which is a huge area that AI has started to make inroads into, but it still can be very lucrative for freelance writers. And so freelance writers and I belong to the American Association of Journalists and Authors, and I've been a member since 1997. And that is people who are making a living as a freelance writer or an author. And a lot of people cobble in, they teach. I teach as well. And I love teaching at NYU for Writer's Digest and my one-on-one coaching. And sometimes to your point about adding in who you are, sometimes I'll say NYU writing professor, if I think it's going to help, it's not always going to help because what an editor is looking for is the story idea. So maybe say widely published journalists and they'll realize, oh, it's not a novice.
(08:01):
But again, you have to really have the title in there, I think of what you're pitching. And it also helps you ground you as you put your pitch together. So there are bloggers who want to be writers. There are authors who want to do a piece, like a supplement piece that ties in with whatever nonfiction book or memoir that they are trying to sell and promote. And that can be very effective because you get to put in the byline a memoir is coming out or a book is coming out, here's the link or a book just came out or here's my website. So again, that kind of cobbles together like threads, all the different elements of who a writer is and where you can find them and what they're promoting. Does that answer your question? Yes.
Kim (08:51):
So it's for authors, people who want to write writers, and it's for business owners trying to promote themselves as a contributor. Now when you're talking about writing, are these paid articles or sometimes paid and sometimes not.
Estelle (09:04):
So I always say to writers that they should be paid for their work, especially if they've been in the business for a while. With that said, there are places that don't pay like tiny Love stories, which many of my students have gotten into in the style section of the New York Times is a hundred words and less, but there is a credential associated with being in that column. And in fact, I had a tiny love story. I wasn't paid for it, it was a hundred words, but it's part of my memoir and progress. And so I was very happy to have it out because I could send it to agents and other gatekeepers and it's something I have in my back pocket and so do many of my students. And I actually am going to be doing a webinar on micro memoir for Writer's Digest and I'll be speaking about and doing a workshop at the Irma Bombeck Writers Conference. So writing micro memoir is an easy way to, in a hundred to 250 words, which for some other places like Beautiful Things, which is part of another literary publication, again, it gets your words out river teeth, it gets your words out and it shows that you can connect to whatever it is that you're focused on in terms of a larger length project.
Kim (10:30):
Yeah, because seen a lot of places where if you're trying to contribute an article, they won't pay you and it'll say that on the site. It'll say, we don't pay for contributing articles.
Estelle (10:38):
And I would not advocate doing that unless you're starting out and you don't have any clips to your name. If it's not a really high level publication like the New York Times for that small section, I know there are other places that don't pay and I don't advocate that my students go there. I do think there are enough paying places at the moment where they can go.
Kim (11:01):
So you're talking about pitching places, you pitch the idea and then they'll hire you to write it. And so it's not because a lot of times or contributor where maybe an op-ed, it's fully written, you submit, it's fully written, it's not paid for anything like that.
Estelle (11:13):
So there are two elements to that for an article, whether it's a reported article, which means that a reported essay, which means that it's an essay framed around reported elements, which could be polls, which could be studies, which could be expert quotes that elevate the story and show that there is interest and a widespread reason for the topic or that an article, just a strict article, how to, you need to pitch that and really share the who, what, when, where, and how that we learned in grade school. In three paragraphs, editors do not have time for the two pages of your that they used to receive. And then a little bit about your bio, who you are with any clips. If you don't have clips, as I say in my book writing that gets noticed. No clips, no problem. You can find tangential ways to connect your experience to what you want to write about or to connect some other kind of experience that you've had.
(12:22):
Maybe you've written SEO work, maybe you've written white papers, maybe you contributed to a book or an anthology. All of that you can find something that you could use. Now for an essay, most editors want the essay to be fully written. And the reason is an essay is all in the execution. It's all in how you use words. It's all in the narrative arc. It's all in the inciting incident, how you bring out the action of the story and the words that you use. And you can't tell that from a pitch about an essay, I'm going to write about a marriage gone wrong and what I did to fix it. Okay, that's your story. So the editor has to see your voice. And I talk about voice a lot in my book and how to get your voice out and get it on the page. And one of my tips I'll share is to watch TV with the captions on because you can see TV writers have to in an hour and a half hour get the audience attention, get the story moving. They use dialogue, they use a lot of interesting ways of pulling you into the story and you can take it in viscerally and use it in your work. So I always recommend that.
Kim (13:45):
Oh, I love that. I actually used to write for tv, I wrote hour long shows I wrote for news, but then I wrote hour long shows. And I think it's interesting, I just told someone this, I think there's sort of a push pull between magazine or print writers and TV writers are like, you're not really a writer. I'm like, I don't know. I just wrote an hour long TV show. I feels like I'm a writer, but I think you're right about every word has weight and has to be specific, advance the story forward, create something. And so it's the same rules about the who at when editing down taking out words so that you're really only getting to what's most important. I love what you said about no clips. No problem. One of the things I pitched myself for speeches, I pitched myself for writing articles, some of which I've written or been featured in.
(14:26):
So I've pitched a lot. I love your no clips, no problem. I got a keynote. I saw someone had a call for a keynote speaker, which is rare, but I was like, yeah, I'll submit for this. And I kept setting them examples of me speaking. I sent them my podcast episode. I sent them a video of me talking to camera, because if you're going to speak for 35 minutes, they need to be captivated by you for one minute or three minutes or five minutes. So I had to put myself on camera in a way that was more keynotey and less educational, which I do a lot of my content. So I love that example that you said about even if you don't have clips, here's how to make clips that can show them you could do what they need you to do. So it's like I love that.
Estelle (15:07):
Yes. And there's some great tools now, I mean ai, everyone's really down on ai, but AI can really support a writer. It can help you think of ideas, it can help you organize your work. It can help you take video clips and break them down into short segments. And so there are so many ways to use ai. Not for writing though. Not for writing.
Kim (15:30):
I actually interviewed a really famous marketer who we talked about ai, and he was like, the majority of AI written content does worse than human written content. So when you're talking about idea generation, fine efficiency, fine, but actually writing not good and the more people use it, the less it's going to work in terms of make you stand out.
Estelle (15:47):
Exactly. And if you really look at AI right now, it's very flowery writing. It's almost like an academic, but trying to be literary, it's very strange,
Kim (15:58):
Very strange.
Estelle (15:59):
I do expect it to keep changing and growing, and I do expect it to be ultimately keeping a problem for authors because that whole identity situation. But the other thing I wanted to bring up is Op-Ed should be written in full. Again, it's in the execution. And Op-Ed starts with something you're passionate about. In addition to teaching people who are in the working world, in the School of Professional studies at NYUI teach a high school academy where high school students come from all over the country, all over the world, from Dubai, from London, from Paris to study journalism with me. And one of the things I do, because like high schoolers, I mean I have a 14-year-old daughter. To get their attention, to get them involved in something, it has to relate to them. So I say, write an op-ed about something you're passionate about.
(16:51):
And they're writing that their school is insisting that they wear uniforms and there's no good reason or that they're being locked in classrooms eight hours a day and they should be outside because they can get vitamin C. And then I'll say, great, and let's find some studies to support that and add that into your op. And they get very excited because again, an op-ed is your opinion about something that you are then sharing with supportive evidence why you think this will work. And you end with an action item. So if you're writing about depression and you have ideas for depression and schools that's not being treated correctly, then you would say, and so according to the studies that come out, you should have a nurse involved and you should do this. And obviously if you connect it to your own experience, that makes it even more compelling and powerful.
(17:49):
So I wrote an op-ed for the Washington Post about why my husband does the laundry and that husband should and that partner should. And that kind of went viral too. And I included studies that supported why it's important for children to see their parents, their other parent doing the work and supporting and that that will bring them along. So again, it's finding these ways of supporting with research. And I have a big section in my book about how to find credible research because it's so important. You're not just going to go onto the wide web and just pull the first thing you see because it could be a proprietary site. You could be writing about health and it's an actual drug company that in tiny, tiny little print that you can't even see has this website. And you're like, yeah, I'm going to pull that out.
(18:48):
And the editor will know better and say, why are you sharing a site from a manufacturer of a drug when you're writing about the field in general? And so you really need to know what to look for and what's credible. So I share over 200 credible websites in social science, in psychology and health in every aspect that you would want to go to finding old newspaper articles, things that really will support. And writing is exciting because again, if you can put your voice on the page, and I always encourage my students, and I talk about it in my book, that if they want to make a name for themselves, don't do listicles. Right? Listicles is when it's like 10 top places to have tea. Okay, that's not going to do anything for you. But if you are going to write about how tea changed my life and it could change yours too, and here's how you can put yourself in the beginning of the story and you can put yourself in the end.
(19:50):
And so that brings it in. And I'm very convinced that the reason I was asked to go on Good Morning America is because my story, how to bulletproof your child. I talked about an experience that my daughter had being bullied, and then I brought in the experts and then I brought in the research. And so that got me to be in the story and they wanted to speak to me. I could have just done a strictly reported story about bullying, but then I'm just the name the author, but I'm not the person who's involved in the story. And I think it's a great way to get your writing noticed,
Kim (20:32):
Inject yourself, make sure the story is pegged to you and you're not just the sort of the third person objective journalist, but rather you are a player in the story. And then when the story catches on, or that's how you could get on TV or get additional press because you are a part of the story versus researching some outside thing that's disconnected from your life.
Estelle (20:52):
Absolutely. And it doesn't have to be really hitting them over the head with a sledgehammer, you could start in the beginning and you can end it at the end. And you don't have to have it everywhere on the story, but have it somewhere.
Kim (21:07):
Okay, Estelle, I'm going to ask you, I want to know your top three tips to catch an editor's eye to get published.
Estelle (21:14):
Okay, so aside from the valuable word real estate in the subject line, I would start in a compelling way in your pitch. So if you want to pitch an essay, why don't you? I call it writing to the reader. Have the first three paragraphs of what is going to be in your essay to show the editor a couple of things. One, your writing style, two, your voice on the page and get them excited about how you convey your words. It could be very effective rather than just say, I want to write about an incident where my daughter danced at the library. You share the first part of it. The other thing I would do to get an editor's attention is make sure that you are showing them that you understand their publication if they are a publication. I had this when I was with American Woman Magazine.
(22:06):
It was a magazine for women who were married and or divorced. It wasn't really for single women, and yet people would be sending me a lot of information about single women. Then later we ended up actually doing stuff for single women, but in the beginning it wasn't. And then I would say that after the publication, make sure that you show that there is a widespread interest in the subject that you are pitching. So let's say you are pitching something. Let's say that you're pitching a story about a trend happening. If you can show that this trend is happening not just in your local city but nationwide, and maybe it's part of a movement, maybe I'm just making this up, but using stuffed animals to soothe adults before they go to bed is actually an idea that somebody had pitched one of my students and I helped them begin to tweak it, but they still are looking for more information.
(23:11):
And one of my tips that I share in my book where I share 352 pages of tips, tricks, and strategies gleaned from my 30 years in publishing on both sides of the publishing wall, I tell them to set up Google alerts with the topic that they want to cover. And so if you say, I want to cover stuffed animals soothing children, you'll get any kind of research studies or any kind of information that can then kind of perk you. And I will say one more thing. If you want to write about a situation, if you can connect it to something happening in the culture that would be really successful. Somebody who had read my book, she set up a Google alert for Curb Your Enthusiasm because she was doing a ritual with her husband around that, and she found out that it was the last season.
(24:03):
And so it made it timely When she pitched to an editor, Noah Michelson at the Huffington Post, who's actually been on my podcast and he took the article when I wanted to write about Penny Marshall who died in 2018. I had missed the boat when she died because it goes very fast. The news cycle goes fast. I wanted to write how she influenced my life. So I did a Google Alert set up for anything Penny Marshall related, and I received news that a League of their own was going to become an Amazon Prime series. I said, perfect. So I wrote a little thing about that, and then I framed it around how she impacted my life, and I sent it to an editor at a RP, the Ethel, which has 60 million readers, and they said, yes, we'd love you to write this for us. So this was three years after she died.
Kim (24:56):
One thing I've learned from working in media is like, there's anniversaries, there's sequels, there's a birthday. I agree. Once you start thinking creatively about how to peg yourself to culture. Okay, one more question. Once someone has their amazing pitch with all those great tips you led, how can they find the contact of the person to reach out to?
Estelle (25:14):
So there's places that you can go. You can look on LinkedIn number one, and you can see how many of the people who follow you follow somebody else. And then you can do a search for editors. Twitter used to be excellent for that. You could go editor at, and then you could put the publication name and editors would come up. And very often when an editor, you could go back through time if editors didn't prevent you from doing that. And often when somebody had their first day in a job, they would say, Hey, I'm now here at Cosmopolitan. Send me an email. I'm at blah, blah, blah. Two years later, they won't do that so much because they've been inundated. But in the beginning you can get that and you can also go to MuckRack. And there's another place that I put in my book that I forget right now, but there's other places that you can go and maybe just get a free count and then you can look for editors names.
Kim (26:14):
Amazing. Estelle, this has been so helpful and full of information. I want to share Estelle's fun facts right before we wrap up, that you studied opera and that you were on Guiding Light, which I love. That's amazing. Talk to me about how people can find you and connect with you afterwards.
Estelle (26:30):
Sure. They can go to my website, estelleserasmus.com, and it has a contact Estelle section there. They can also email me at FreelanceWritingdirect@gmail.com. And I am everywhere on social media, including TikTok at Estelle S Erasmus, and Instagram, Twitter, X, Threads, blue sky, you name it, I'm there. And my substack, where I do special clips from my guests is estelleserasmus.substack.com. And I just love doing my podcast Freelance Writing direct, where I've talked to Cheryl Stray and Hood editors, assigning editors from top publications like narratively, like Wired, like HuffPost, personal Writer's Digest, and I talk to people in the media world who tell you how to source for photos, who tell you legally what you need to do, how to get noticed, how to do the right moves media wise to get yourself situated, to be a flourishing freelance writer, flourishing author, flourishing blogger, flourishing media person, whatever it is. I cover it through my conversations focused on really actionable advice because I honed my teeth on service journalism from my first job in publishing at Woman's World Magazine where I had seven deadlines a week and interviewed everybody from John Frieda to Mar Na Balme to Latrice Eman from the Pantone Color Institute to health experts and authors. And it was so much fun, and I love the publishing world. I just want to help people succeed. Awesome.
Kim (28:29):
Thank you so much.
Estelle (28:30):
My pleasure. Thank you for having me. It's been great talking to you.
Kim (28:34):
If you like this episode, please rate it, review it, share it with a friend, and screenshot it and tag me @Kimrittberg. And don't forget, you can grab my free download How to Shine on camera at kimrittberg.com/newsletter.
Kim (28:49):
Thank you for joining us. Don't forget to exit the grind and enter success on your own terms. This is the exit interview with Kim Rittberg. Don't forget to grab my free download, how to Grow Your Business with Amazing video at kimrittberg.com and linked out in the show notes. I love to hear your feedback. Make sure to submit to me what you learned from the show and how your crushing it on your own terms. Connect with me on Instagram or LinkedIn at Kim Rittberg, R-I-T-T-B-E-R-G. And this show is edited by Jillian Grover and produced by Henry Street Media. I'm your host and executive producer Kim Rittberg.